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[Poll]
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Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient?
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| Yes |
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| No |
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| I don't know |
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Total Votes : 21
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(last vote on : 11/21/2008 7:20:54 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/7/2008 7:23:09 PM
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1love1God1way
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I think that this is kind of interesting. I like the word "relationship" for this reason -- a relationship denotes a two-way connection.
Is knowing Christ enough? Matthew 7 says:
21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'
As Paul Washer says, knowing Christ is not enough. The question is: does He know us?
What this then entails to is what it means to have this relationship. How do we get to the point where Christ "knows us?" (and thus, a relationship).
In short . . . a lifestyle of repentance and obedience. Love God, love people.
_____________________________
love.ben
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/8/2008 9:41:16 AM
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raivyne
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very well said!
_____________________________
P.U.S.H. – Pray Until Something Happens
What if God is asking us for a sign?
Knowledge is proud; wisdom is humble.
Patiently waiting for my KSA
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/11/2008 8:03:46 AM
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nettiel
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 you can have a great relationship with god, but if your not doing what he tells us to do what than?
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/11/2008 8:43:01 AM
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floydette
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quote:
ORIGINAL: nettiel
you can have a great relationship with god, but if your not doing what he tells us to do what than?
That could depend on a few things nettiel. It could be that one could be new to this kind of God-relationship, and not understand what they are called to.
Or, they could be in a time of life where they are working through many issues within themselves. God invites them to do something, and they are not yet ready to go there. Not too different from encouraging a someone to try something that they deem as "scary" and they choose not to do it. So, one keeps encouraging. God is very much like this. That is the great thing about God, he is very kind, and knows us quite well. He understands why some of the things we do may be different from what he invites us to. He is very persistent, and keeps on inviting us.
Or, third, it could be our own perception of what we think God is calling others to - and he isn't calling them to that thing at all. In that, sometimes we offer up a judgment, saying that person isn't doing what God told them to do - but those judgments are usually looked at through our own point of view.
Bean - great thread. I believe you are asking good questions.
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“The eye sees only what the mind is prepared to comprehend.” Henri Bergson
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/11/2008 11:33:32 PM
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bob97
Posts: 2019
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quote:
you can have a great relationship with god, but if your not doing what he tells us to do what than?
There is only one way to have a relationship with God and that is to abide by His will. The more we abide the better the relationship.
Unless we hold up our end of the bargain the relationship goes nowhere.
Bob
_____________________________
The LORD clears the road for me!
The LORD is my high ridge, my stronghold, my deliverer!
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/20/2008 10:10:31 AM
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Heavendweller
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Beanteaser
quote:
The phrase "personal relationship with Jesus" is usually used as a requirement FOR salvation. I have been hearing it for most of my life, but now think it has become a cliche that weakens the actual salvation message.
Beanteaser, the problem that something becomes a cliche doesn't make the concept wrong. Rather, it is because our hearts can become cold toward God that the phrase becomes commonplace. So the phrase in and of itself is not wrong, even though the terminology isn't explicity written in Scripture. One of the reasons for the Incarnation, Emmanuel, God With Us, was to make this kind of "personal" salvation available to us. Christ said that no one has seen God. But when we look at Him with spiritual eyes, we do indeed "see" God. And when one has this kind of encounter, it is VERY personal indeed! What did Isaiah say when he encountered the Living God? "I am a man of unclean lips." We are aware of our sinfulness and the need to daily depend upon our Creator, Who made the blueprint for our lives.
However, I wouldn't limit salvation to a mere phrase. We can never fully plunge the depths of God in this life. He is vaster than the universe and deeper than the ocean. We can attest to what St. Paul said, "In Him we live and move and have our being." When that reality penetrates our hearts, we discover that there is no life to be found outside of Christ our Lord. Each day that I wake, I am reminded of Him in whom I "live and move and have my being." Throughout the day, I am reminded of Him in whom I "live and move and have my being." As I place my head upon the pillow, I am reminded of Him of whom I "live and move and have my being."
When we partake of the Lord's Supper, we are communing with Him in such a personal way that is only for those who are His. This meal is closed to those who do not have His Spirit abiding within them. With this said, not all children of God are equally close to Him. Some have a more personal relationship with Him than others. But our desire should be that of David as he proclaimed, "There is nothing I desire on earth besides thee." But this "personal" relationship takes time and requires obedience. Our Lord says, "He who does not take up his cross daily and follow me is not worthy to be my disciple." So sacrifice on our part is required in order for this "personal" relationship with our Lord to grow and deepen.
May each of us long for Him and love Him more deeply. May we desire that He will increase in us and we will decrease. May we discover more fully the love of the Trinity and embrace our Lord more closely with the dawn of each new day.
Heavendweller
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See what love the Father has given us, that we should be called children of God; and so we are. I John 3:1
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/20/2008 12:31:53 PM
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bravjim
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Beanteaser
Before you vote, I ask that you read my post.
The phrase "personal relationship with Jesus" is usually used as a requirement FOR salvation. I have been hearing it for most of my life, but now think it has become a cliche that weakens the actual salvation message. When we study Scripture to understand how we are saved, we come across verses like Romans 10:9, Ephesians 3:8, and John 3:16, but no where in Scripture is the phrase "personal relationship with Jesus" found. Now, this relationship does exist, but I think it is a natural result OF salvation.
So my question is "Is a personal relationship with Jesus sufficient for salvation?"
A pesonal relationship with Jesus is the result of salvation. Salvation does not come from the personal relationship, except in that we must continue to let our relationship grow. Salvation comes from the call upon you by God to acknowledge Him and His son and His work upon the cross. He will lead you to salvation through that call, but your relationship to Him doesn't begin until you accept the call (salvation).
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I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfilll the lust of the flesh.
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/20/2008 1:26:54 PM
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LCannon
Posts: 1226
Joined: 2/22/2007
From: Lebanon, OR
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The 'result' of the appropriation(claiming for oneself)of His sacrifice/Victory results in ongoing obedience and vulnerability to His prompting and leading.
"A good tree cannot bear bad fruit nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus you will know them by their fruits.(Matthew 7:18,19)
_____________________________
"It may be that when the angels go about their task of praising God they play
only Bach. I am sure, however, that when they are together en famille they
play Mozart and then too our dear Lord listens with special pleasure."(Karl Barth)
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/21/2008 2:13:04 PM
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Prairiehiker
Posts: 3282
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Isn't it possible to put your faith in Jesus to save you from hell, live according to the guidelines stated in the bible, and not have a close personal relationship with Him?
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Wishing for a Steelers/Eagles superbowl.
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/21/2008 3:21:14 PM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2478
Joined: 5/16/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Prairiehiker
Isn't it possible to put your faith in Jesus to save you from hell, live according to the guidelines stated in the bible, and not have a close personal relationship with Him?
Again, I refer back to Matthew 7 when Jesus said "I never knew you."
Doing the works and believing Jesus is Lord isn't enough. Does Christ know us?
_____________________________
love.ben
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/21/2008 9:45:08 PM
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Prairiehiker
Posts: 3282
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
quote:
ORIGINAL: Prairiehiker
Isn't it possible to put your faith in Jesus to save you from hell, live according to the guidelines stated in the bible, and not have a close personal relationship with Him?
Again, I refer back to Matthew 7 when Jesus said "I never knew you."
Doing the works and believing Jesus is Lord isn't enough. Does Christ know us?
Isn't there a difference between those who do good because they are trying to earn salvation vs those who do good because they've put their faith in God and are trying to follow the rules as stated in the bible. I mean, don't tell me that there's not a lot of do's and don't in the bible, because if you read through the apostle's writing, most of them are do this and do that. But those were given to the church; to the ones who are already saved. Then, it is possible that a person can have faith in the saving power of Jesus Christ who is not relating to Him in a personal way but is doing His work because she/he is following the apostles writings.
_____________________________
Wishing for a Steelers/Eagles superbowl.
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/22/2008 12:31:49 AM
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bob97
Posts: 2019
Joined: 6/24/2006
From: Kansas
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quote:
Then, it is possible that a person can have faith in the saving power of Jesus Christ who is not relating to Him in a personal way but is doing His work because she/he is following the apostles writings.
Even evil spirits believe in the saving power of Jesus Christ!
There is only one way to have salvation and that is to believe Christ to be the Son of God...that He died for our sins and to confess Him to be our personal savor. Christ must live within our hearts...there is no such thing as working out our our salvation, it is by faith alone.
Bob
_____________________________
The LORD clears the road for me!
The LORD is my high ridge, my stronghold, my deliverer!
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/23/2008 11:39:34 AM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2478
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bob97
quote:
Then, it is possible that a person can have faith in the saving power of Jesus Christ who is not relating to Him in a personal way but is doing His work because she/he is following the apostles writings.
Even evil spirits believe in the saving power of Jesus Christ!
There is only one way to have salvation and that is to believe Christ to be the Son of God...that He died for our sins and to confess Him to be our personal savor. Christ must live within our hearts...there is no such thing as working out our our salvation, it is by faith alone.
Bob
Phillipians 2:
12Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, 13for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.
_____________________________
love.ben
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/23/2008 6:04:52 PM
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frankman
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 1love1God1way
Phillipians 2:
12Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, 13for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.
At first glance it may seem like Phil.2:12+13 are a complete contradiction of "bob97`s" post,  however, hang on, don`t write Bob`s post off just yet.
First of all who was Paul referring to in this verse? The "your" in this verse were the "saints" Paul wrote to in Phil.1:1. "To all the saints in Jesus Christ at Philippi". These people were all already saved for they were called saints.
So because these people already were trusting Christ for their salvation and were already set apart for Him, they were now to "work to full completion" the work they were called to do. Now that we are saved by faith alone God wants us to strive for Christlikeness. Rom.8:29 tells us what the "work out your salvation with fear and trembling" in Phil.2:12 was referring to. We are to work "to be conformed to the likeness of His Son". Like a mathematics problem, life is full of many challenges, and God wants to help us work out each challenge to it`s full potential. In order for us to be at full potential in our everyday work for Christ a personal relationship with Jesus is not an option.
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"Is not My word like fire,` declares the LORD, `and like a hammer that breaks a rock in peaces?" Jeremiah 23:29
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RE: Is a personal relationship with Jesus Sufficient? - 10/23/2008 8:42:39 PM
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1love1God1way
Posts: 2478
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While I understand it is written to the Christians, I believe it means basically as it says. . . work it out, because salvation is on ongoing process.
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love.ben
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